YEREVAN (A.W.)—At a Barevolution rally in Freedom Square, opposition leader Raffi Hovannisian said that Serge Sarkisian would be sworn in as president “over my dead body,” adding that he will start a hunger strike in the square.
“I am starting a hunger strike. I will not eat, and I will not accept deception and threats from anyone,” Hovannisian said.
“If on April 9, Sarkisian takes his fake oath on the Holy Bible, and if the Catholicos desecrates the Bible and blesses the candidate [Sarkisian] who mocks the people, then that will happen over my dead body,” he said.
Until April 9, Sarkisian should accept the demand of the overwhelming majority of the population, recognize the victory of the people, and resign, noted Hovannisian.
He also demanded the resignation of all governors. Having appealed to the Constitutional Court to present its verdict on the presidential election, he added, “If the Constitutional Court does not correct its path, we will say goodbye to them too, and we will create our own court on the square.”
Why does Raffi think this is a good plan of action? He should just hold his nose for another term and run again when there is no incumbent. Have the international election monitors said that the election was a at least 65% fraudulent? Serzh and the rest will call his bluff and then either he will die for this idiot or he will have to call off his hunger strike and look weak. Unfortunately we all have to live with certain realities that take longer to change than we would like but they can change, it will just take a little longer than expected. Next time around he should make more of an effort to get campaign contributions from the US and then he will have more money to do what he needs to do to win in Armenia.
Tsoghig,
The votes Raffi got mostly were anti-Serz votes. He just got lucky this time. Next time there will be other opposition parties so he will not be able to get that many votes. He is making fool of himself by constantly remanding resignations. Who is going to resign upon his request? He is a very weak leader in my opinion.
Another 5 years the country will empty! You want another 5 years of corruption, injustice, robbery, murder?
“Another 5 years the country will empty! You want another 5 years of corruption, injustice, robbery, murder?”
I do not want any of that, however I do not think Raffi can do any better. That is all. Armenia does not need an Armenian Saakashvili, sorry.
“Another 5 years the country will empty!”
Armenia is not going to empty in 5 years. Please stop this paranoia created by Axeris and their Turkish brothers. You do realize that you are repeating their propaganda?
I think Raffi is acting in a silly and immature way. I rightly predicted in previous posts that he will call for a second hunger strike. But what does that achieve? Has anyone heard of a presidential candidate going on hunger strike? Wouldn’t a hunger strike make him an even weaker link? Woudn’t it make him look like a “Manoog” who wants to become “Takavor”?
It would have been advisable to properly do his homework and rally the opposition parties before the elections, and become the running candidate of all who opposed the incumbent president. But he failed to do so, and now, having no team, it became obviously a lot harder (after the elections) to seek any kind of sustainable support from inside or outside the country. It is a pity, for a good man to go down like this, by making a fool of himself. Armenia has enough problems which cannot be solved with a “dziranakuyn” revolution.
Raffi, you are a spoiled chiled, in other words a”TITIZ”. Get over it and leave the people to get on with their life.
I think you have a completely biased view of what is going on in Armenia right now. If the current regime of oligarchies continue to rule Armenia We will have another Spitak Jard which is going on by today, the criminals who are ruling the country now have monopolized all the industry and natural resources simply not giving any ctizen an air to breath, during last 4-5 years more than 200 thouasand have immigrated from Armenia, and about the elections.. how could international mission identify the big fraud going on in the marzes and villages of Armenia, in many electoral districts the final results were reported vice versa, Voters have been terrorized by the regim agents (Goghakan Criminals working for oligarchis) to vote for current president ,with all these fraud You are calling Raffi to get over it? Do you only watch h1 or you think that nationalism is only about Armenian genoccide? What do you want an Armenia without Armenians? I strongly suggest you to come and live in Armenia for 6 months, and not in the gorgeous center of Yerevan, but in the villages and marz centers to see what is really going on in Armenia.. and instead of Regime’s propaganda channels you can watch more unbiased news channels such as civilnet or azatutyun.am
The Catholicos and the church should refuse to participate.
That’s what I thought you would say….”MORE MONEY…to do what he needs to do”. True!!!! because you believe that MONEY TALKS…..right?????
If so ,then what on earth IDOES THE WORD DEMOCRACY SSTAND FOR ???pray tell me…..PERHAPS DEM0 MONEY????
like it is practiced next to where you are…with POWER BROKERS IN CORRIDORS, —–LOBBIES????same thing..and these b r o k e r s …..like a turk would say Tellal,also I believe in arabic and Persian…in Armenian,it is called մ ի ջ ն ո ր դ …. THAT IS SOMEONE WHO intervenes in business.Apparently in politics also….right??????
So if tomorrow I win the Jackpot of 500 million,I shall buy many through brokers to elect me…O.K: satisfied ….
Let then outright be declared that our RA is a copy of the so called pother such ¨Demcracies¨….
But wait ,I read somewhere inm the Tashnag ARF press, that latter may at 11th hour come to the aid of Raffi and perhaps a few other small political parties plus INDEED THE THICK OF THE PEOPLE WHO ARE DISSATISFIED, with the regime/system.
Alas!!! My prophecy,rather suggestion to have Serge Sargsyan insist that he would accept Paruryr Hairikian ,Raffi Hovhannissian and Hrant Bagratyan (as starters) in his New Glov.t in a CONCILLIATORY MODE ,TRANSITIONAL GOVT hasnot been heeded. it is not too late.I believe, with raffi´s hunger strike things might look a bit more bitter,especially if as said above ARF catches up an dextends a hand to him , also the T H I C K OF THE PEOPEL. For you see,I do also respect that according polls,Raffi had garnered more and above all the people can come out IF NEED BE AND ASK FOR A SECOND R U N !!!!NOT POSSIBLE????
TIME WILL TELL .The fact that over a million have L E F T ARMENIA in search of bread!!!! plus nothing serious having been don e so far to curb it, is there. No can can deny that.
I still hjope that ARF,plus others will back him up (Raffi ,i.e.)You may think he is a bit annoyed and speaks so exposing his himsself but he is defending his people.Don´t ever forget that.he is A P A T R I O T !!!!!
So are many many others.Some bring as proof that Serj Sargsyan fought in NK.Do you know how many more like him did,head of Jogads..and above all the few generals who came FROM MOSCOW LIKE ARCADY TER TATEVOSIAN (WHO MASTERMINDED AND DIRECTED THE TAKING OF SHOUSHI AND KHOJALI AIRPORT!!!!!
wHEN SOME BRING THAT AS BEING A PLUS FOR sARGSYAN,THEY SHOULD ALSO REMEMBER ALL THE OTHERS PLUS aGHABEKIAN A tASHJNAG gENMERAL TOO btw…AND MNAY OTHERS FROM dAISPROA LIKE mONTE….EH?????
The system in RA is not on a RIGHT PATH.It certainly suits those who have cpongratulated him as re elected pres.,becasue their own countries have experioenced some such…comes to mind Al Gor….etc., etc., etc.,
Armenia should amend the constitution to restrict the president to be natural born citizen. Levon. Raffi. Armenia doesn’t need puppets.
LOL! You realize Kocharian and Sargsyan weren’t born in Armenia, either, right?
Artsakh = Armenia. It is a separate republic for political reasons, but it is part of Armenia and one day it will be official. Those who do not see that are blind. My point is that Armenia needs to be careful from foreign control. We all saw what happened with Levon. I also don’t trust Raffi. I am also not a Armenian citizen, so it is just my opinion.
NKR is not even recognized by Armenia. It’s a self-proclaimed separatist entity which is internationally recognized as part of Azerbaijan.
Serzh is actually under foreign control precisely because he does not draw his legitimacy from his people. So he has to rely on the great powers and dance under their tune. A democratic president may at least counteract that due to him enjoying the legitimacy of his people.
Jack
I agree with you, that who ever born before 1990, in USSR is not real Armenian either, they are part of brainwashed communist era corrupted politicians from Soviet Empire, like Armenia’s blood sucker oligarchs!!
Armenia is waiting for a real smart, educated, young nationalist, with no Soviet style corrupted individual, who has big Armenian balls to clean the house, and lead our beloved Armenia, politically, economically, militarily, with justice and rule of law!! Do you have someone in your mind today??
This is a disappointment. How will the emaciation of Raffi Hovanissian help Armenia develop its democracy? There are constitutional and legal paths that should be pursued with passion and persistence. I agree with Tsoghig . It takes time for democracy to mature and Raffi should use this moment in history, his moment, to show how a democracy should function—-even in the face of suspicious election results.
Come on Raffi, jan. Armenia does not need one more martyr. Work the system with dogged determination. Use your soapbox and your knowledge of international law to show the people of Armenia that democracy can work. The hunger strike undermines this goal. It suggests that because democratic processes are sometimes slow, they are too weak to fight this battle and that we need to turn to coercive tactics. Coercion, whether by strong-armed oligarchs and their thugs or by emotionally charged hunger strikers, has no place in democracy. And a dead Raffi Hovanissian is no good to anyone.
Tsoghig,
he already won in Armenia. If you take out the fraud (i.e., polling stations with more than 80 percent turnout!), he got more votes than the gangster! To see how much turnout-enhancing fraud really took place (mostly ballot stuffing and vote count manipulations) you need to keep in mind that most of those towns and villages where the gangster received those high percentages more than half the population is no longer in Armenia and cannot vote! So in actual terms, SS “won” only because of polling stations that registered in excess of 140-150 percent participation! Can you imagine that?! So the fraud is much more massive than regular people imagine. Here is what OSCE-ODIHR said in its interim report: “An OSCE/ODIHR EOM analysis of official results shows a correlation between very high turnout and the number of votes for the incumbent. This raises concerns regarding the confidence over the integrity of the electoral process.” (Executive Summary, page 2, http://www.osce.org/odihr/elections/99931). Also, Policy Forum Armenia’s (PFA) Press Release sheds light on the most common forms of fraud by using three critical tests of fraud-detection statistical methodologies commonly used in the applied social science literature (check out the charts embedded in the text here: http://www.pf-armenia.org/press-release/pfa-publishes-results-its-preliminary-analysis-presidential-election-armenia). Finally, Frederik Sjoberg from Columbia University (who has done a fair amount of research on election fraud in former Soviet republics agrees with these findings in his recent entry in a popular social science Blog (here: http://themonkeycage.org/blog/2013/03/01/the-protesters-are-right-evidence-suggests-more-election-fraud-in-last-weeks-elections-in-armenia/). This is not to mention two Russian statisticians and an Armenian physicist, who independently confirmed that Raffi had a lead. He needs to secure his victory now and not five years down the road. Nothing will be different then–the criminals, who assigned SS 58 percent of the vote will do so again in 2018 (remember, it’s not about how people vote–it’s about who counts the vote!). The time for Raffi to act is now and we all need to help him to help us. There may not be Armenia as we know it five years down the road.
David this is very interesting. Can Raffi get some outide force to enforce what the OSCE reported on? What can Raffi do?
Tsoghig,
I doubt the OSCE’s interim (or the forthcoming final) statement will have any tangible value. The damage has already been done and the likes of Putin, Obama, and Abdula Gul have already congratulated SS. How ironic, isn’t it?
It is now up to the people of Armenia and the Diaspora to overturn this by a massive civil disobedience campaign, which Raffi is now leading. In the Diaspora, a newly-established grassroots network, Armenian Renaissance (with chapters in LA, Toronto, Paris, Beirut, and Brussels) is now leading this fight. Professionals organizations, such as the Armenian Bar and Policy Forum Armenia, are also supporting them.
Jack,
how about Robik and Sergik? They weren’t born in Armenia either…
Also, are you a Diaspora Armenian? If yes, then that makes you a poppet, if I follow your logic.
Why are you refusing the people of Armenia the right to be better governed and have a stronger country? Are you a Turk or an Azeri?
Do you want another Armenia-Turkey protocols signed on April 24, 2015? Serge Sargsyan will get you that. Is that why you are against Raffi?
Correct me if im wrong but wasn’t the last Pres and this Pres From Karabagh?
Precisely. And since the NKR is not even recognized by Armenia, Robert and Serzh are Azerbaijani citizens. Call me biased, but I would rather have a U.S. citizen president of Armenia than an Azeri citizen.
Yes, Armenia only needs diaspora’s money and nothing else. They can use that money for their businesses and get so rich. Who cares about poor and jobless citizens? After all, they can emigrate and even go to Turkey for not starving. I think only diaspora cares about our homeland, the rest are singing, dancing, and praising Serj. This is a real tragedy.
Boyajian,
you say: “It takes time for democracy to mature and Raffi should use this moment in history, his moment, to show how a democracy should function—-even in the face of suspicious election results.”
I am curious to know, what country are you talking about when you refer to “democracy”? If it is Armenia, do you care to explain how exactly “democracy should function—-even in the face of suspicious election results”? Otherwise, with all due respect, it sounds like you are engaged in (factually incorrect) intellectual masturbation, if not nicely covered attempt to aide the regime of SS…
What would it take for the Diasporans to understand the true extent of the hole the country is in (and try to help the people who are fighting to turn the country in a better place) or just shut up and let the events take their course? Didn’t you learn back in 2009 that having a weak and illegitimate president leads to funny things, like Armenia-Turkish protocols?
I assure you that I applaud Raffi and support his efforts to end corruption and make sure that every Armenian has a voice and a vote that counts.
I don’t support the hunger strike. I think it is dangerous to the cause and dangerous to Raffi. I don’t see how it will force SS to resign. Why this move now? Have all other avenues failed?
I don’t pretend to have the definitive answer….I am just not sure who or what is served by such a gesture. If Raffi plays this out he may end up dead or if he quits, he weakens his credibility.
Why is Raffie following the footstep of Der Petrossian. Why can’t he accept the results and graciously move on and help to improve the country. There was no overwhelming support for him. He lost the election simple as that. This is not patriotic it is a travesty.
You’re absolutely right. If he persists and continues like this, people will eventually believe he apparently has more hidden talents of a dictator than those of a wise president.
Organisatuon, organisation and organisation!
Build your organisation RH. You have 4 or 5 years but start now; build your nationwide organisation and programme of action together with your local and national policies.
Slogans without organisation maybe exciting and create street excitment but are are immitation politics and will ultimately lead to mass depression, disappointment and much worse consequences. Mobilise the nation while building your organisation. Fight the organised oligarchic authorities by the people mobilised and organised at every level and by giving people hope and a taste of victory by forcing the oligarchic system to retreat at the village, town and city level, at the educational and scientific institutes and every strata of the population. Building on the current wave of inspiration and hope and without retreating from it you could be winning authority at every level with and for the people and have both the village and the towns and cities and parliament freed from the oligarchs and in healthy national hands while you are building the organisation abd building on people’s hope… .
Only then can you claim real victiry and may even win the presidency in 2018. Without the real work of mibilasation and building of a healthy people based organisation even if the existing oligarchic system “give” you (!!!) the presidential office and authority, you will either have to work with the existing locally and nationally appointed corrupt individuals and authorities or appoint “your own” new generation of potential corrupt opportunists who will continue as we have witnessed since 1990s president after president, election after election.
Wise words.
Come on Raffi Hovanissian ! drop this insane battle ! You’re getting ridiculous in the eyes of all. Even those who wanted to believe in your ridiculous promises will no longer support you! Accept your defeat.
Bagratuni,
Have you been to Raffi Hovhannisian´s Centre for Regional Stcrategic studies in Yerevan? or his Heritage party headquarters? I suppose not…
Otherwise you would not have written above ten times repeated Organmiozation
He certainly has that!!!! go see it.Day in day out people are working there.They hold sesminars, publish books ,pamphlets etc. He has been working!!!!
So mcu for that. If some don´t appreciate what hje is doing that´s their business. As to pressent status quo in Yerevan,surely you are aware that one other organization,rather political party named Prosperous Armenia, with Mr. Gagik Tsarukian at the helm is holding meetigns and they are gloing (supposedly, ARF too) to tackle change o f STAFF shall we say at the Municipality of Yerevan.Latter, ARF, i.e. anounced they would start from there.
At presesnt, the after-elections (a theatrical play rather) the expectancy is (whether you me she he and all) want it or not…..A C H A N G E .
Whether(like it happened in Egypt,after elect. new pres.) the people will calm down stop demos and go back to (no work, for majority)their daily chores,is questianble…
In neighbouring R-of Georgia THAT UNDERSTOOD THAT M I A B E D A G A N -utyun is not wanted…meaning Shahkashvili´s such one person rule.
So they preferred to SEAL IT with a Premiere(Prime Minister) that is in the opposite camp.
I would very much hope that Armenia follow suit,which i have from beginning of this Elections advocated.THAT OF A CONCILLIATORY-TRANSITIONAL Govt. I hope for that.Never midn if not completely a CHANGED Gov.t, but at the very least on the ROAD to that.For the people is tired of the present mode,they wish to see C H A N G E on the scene.Less dictatorial rule, more People´s Rule(.I do not opt for that word (excuse the expression) masturbation of democracy!!! if latter is meant to admit Change,O.K. but without FRAUDS AND MAKE B ELIEVE shows.Above all subjected to foreign MEDDLING!!!!
ARMENIA SHOULD try to send emissaries to the SCANDINAVIAN COUNTRIES and Switzerland to learn things from them .The overnight change that hjappened from ultra communism to wild free market economy has burnt that middle class Armenia.Made it a polarized country…
In this ,I believe the ARF and a few others like Prosperous Armenia could play a Concilliatory role and bring back armenia to a mildly capitalistic mode.LIKE ABOVE DESCRIBED.Whereas some believe that the present rule is what is needed(indeed for their pockets) it is NO GOOD FOR THE THICK OF THE PEOPLE. Armenia needs desperately a M I D D L E C L A S S.The young are aspiring for more ,not just ¨¨make overs¨¨ all over Yerevan!!!!!!!
Miss Maria titizian(a suggestion-take it or leave it) ought to go alongside Raffi and start am endless discourse opting for Democratic Socialism(Swedish) and explain to people that ARF ,when established formed was a political party that was SUPPSED TO BE A GROUPEMENT of All of the Revolutionaies(then) now we don´t even need wor (R)evolution, we need
e v o l u i o n AND WISH TO HAVE ALL those who also opt for same come together and form that,which it started to be.Also drop their(a suggestion) the ARF RED FLAG …which reminds people of a similar RED FLAG!!!!
Սիրելի Րաֆֆի
Դժվար կարողանամ այս անհատական եւ ազգային նամակով իմ կարծիքս բոլորովին բացատրել Բայց կը ջանամ ամփոփել:
Սիրելի Րաֆֆի ձեր ազնվության եւ հայրենասիրության մասին ոչ մի խոսք չկա Բայց եւ այդպես Սովետի եւ մնացորդային կարգերին ծանոթ լինելով մեզ առաջվանից շատ պարզ էր որ ձեզ երբեք չեն թողնելու որ ընտրվեք?
Չը զարմանաք դժբախտաբար տեղացիների (նամանավանդ վերնախավի) 30-40%- ի մոտ դեռ շարունակվում է սուբյեկտիվ (թաքնված )խտրականությունը “Ախպարների” հանդեպ :
Դուք էլ կարծեմ ախպար եք եւ Ամերիրիկահայ:
Ին կարծիքով ամենաքիչը մեկ սերունդ պետք է որ դա փոխվի:
Պետքէ զգուշ լինել ձեր հակառակորդները “Սովետաձեվ” հմուտ մարտավարությանբ կարող են ձեզ վարկաբեկել եւ հայրենիքում ձեզ ապակայունության ստեղծող անձ անվանել
Եթէ դուք էլ պարոն Տեր-Պետրոսյանի նման շարժվեք մենք շատ կը տուժենք? Թողեք մեր հայրենիքը մի քիչ խաղաղ մնա քան թէ……….
Նույնպես զքուշ եղեք ձեր ուշացած նոր կողմնակիցներից, ներսում թէ դրսում կարող են ձեր ժողվրդական նվաճումները High-jack անել
եւ ձեզ մատաղ դարձնել:
Սիրելի Րաֆֆի Հեռու մնացեք զքացումներից Հայրենիքին օգնելու համար շատ զանազան ձեւեր կան:
Մնացեք խաղաղ իշխող դասի հետ: Ջանացեք քաղաքականապես դաստիրակել ժողովրդին եւ տնտեսապես բավարարել մասաներին եւ պահպանեք ձեր ձեռք բերված նվաճումները:
Մեր հայաստանի հայրենակիցներին սովորեցրեք որ Սփիւռքը միայն կթան Կով չէ?
Շարունակեք ձեր սուրբ եւ խաղաղ պայքարը Ով գիտէ կարող է հոյս լինի 5 տարում կամ 30 տարում հրաշքով Արեւելքում եւ Հայաստանում ժողովրդավարություն լինի:
Հերոս Կարո Ակիլեանը ասում է որ
“Իմ Կուսակցությունը իմ երկիրն է”
Սիրով, իշխան
ԱՄՆ
Fredrik/Bagratuni/Pat,
Raffi has won in this election whether you want it or not and he is well advised to go till the end….for the sake of the country, people who live there, the memory of our ancestors, and for my children! It’s not about teams, or platforms, or money–it’s about who counts the vote! Just read this letter that was made public today by an international observer, a former foreign Minister of Ireland (who describes in detail evidence of fraud that Policy Forum Armenia’s research cited above demonstrates to be true on the aggregate scale)… otherwise, just keep your dirty hands away from Armenia!
Dear Garo Ghazarian, Chairman of the Armenian Bar Association
March 5, 2013
You might remember that we spoke at length on the plane from Yerevan to Paris, just after the presidential election. I indicated to you that I felt uneasy about what happened in the polling station and in the TEC that I observed on the day of the election.
To recap, I and my German colleague Hedda Haars observed six polling stations during the day and as instructed by the OSCE core team, we finished observing the election in PEC 26/1 Yeghvard Elementary School No 3. From what we saw, from 7 PM to the close at 8 PM, everything was done correctly.
The presiding officer and team proceeded to count the votes. Again, everything was done in accordance with the instructions. The presiding officer showed to everyone, including ourselves, our interpreter, our driver as well as a proxy on behalf of the incumbent, every vote once he had taken it from the envelope.
Immediately, it transpired that Raffi was hovering up the votes. This caused some surprise with the local participants. Indeed, it became somewhat embarrassing in that virtually every vote was for Raffi. Every odd time, a vote came out for the incumbent, there was a slight laugh from some of the locals. On and on, it continued with Raffi getting virtually all of the votes. The proxy for the incumbent was tallying in a very methodical way and I could see clearly from his tally that Raffi was way ahead. In fact, he actually ran out of paper, Raffi got so many votes over the incumbent. At about 9:15 PM. I sent a text to my principal to say that with 30 percent of the votes counted Raffi was at least 3 to 1 ahead.
During this time and up until when we left, a number of invalid votes were declared. For instance, one vote was declared invalid because the voter had voted for everyone, except the incumbent. Another vote was invalid because the voter voted for somebody who previously contested an election, but not this one. A number of other votes were declared invalid because they did not have the correct mark or indeed no mark at all. I estimated that there were more than 10 during our time there between 8 PM and 10 PM when we left for the TEC.
By the time we left, we both agreed that with approximately 35% of the vote counted, Raffi was ahead by at least 3 to 1. We proceeded to the TEC 26 in Yeghvard and introduced ourselves to the TEC team. The conditions of the location for tabulation at this location were far from ideal. It consisted of two rooms separated by a corridor which meant that I stayed in the room where the chair and deputy chair met with the PEC teams as they came in with their results. My colleague Hedda stayed in the other room where a secretary entered the results from the various protocols.
I was given very little cooperation by the TEC team in that they did not offer any information to me as to the PEC teams coming in with their protocols. The lack of space made it particularly difficult for me to see anything. I had to ask for information, any time I wanted it. My interpreter and driver indicated to me that the team were somewhat uneasy about our presence.
When the results came in from number 26/1, I particularly was interested and asked for the result. This wasn’t forthcoming, but my interpreter got to see the protocol and indicated that the incumbent had beaten Raffi by 382 to 302 approximately. I was astonished by this apparent turnaround since we left the count. I tried to get more information, to no avail.
However, my interpreter then told me that he noticed on the protocol that there were zero invalid votes. I was completely taken aback by this, and I asked my interpreter to let the chair know about my astonishment.
Between then and when we finally finished the tabulation observation at approximately 3:30 AM, I was given little or no cooperation. I finally asked if I could see the final written result and the chair refused. I met up with my colleague Hedda who had expressed satisfaction with what she had seen in the other room, in that the results were properly put onto the computer. I suggested that she might ask the chairman herself for a copy of the protocol. But again he declined waving his hands in the air. We asked if they would be publishing the result and his reply was in the morning. We immediately left. We filled out the necessary form for the OSCE, having kept in constant contact with them during the night.
I’ve been practicing politician here in Ireland for 32 years, contesting and winning every election I personally fought in. I was director of elections board at national and local level for my party. I have never witnessed anything like this. From my experience, I know a trend, when I see one, and something very strange happened to overturn the result, after we left the count in PEC 26/1.
As I stated to you, I feel that full re-examination of this count should take place. I could not understand then and still now how invalid votes can become valid.
If you require any further information please do not hesitate to contact me.
Dermot Ahern
2013 presidential election observer of OSCE in Armenia, former Minister of Foreign Affairs and former Minister of Justice and Law Reform of the Republic of Ireland
David,
You write the Policy Forum Armenia article, and then you cite it as the definitive source for what you are stating. What you are doing is highly unethical. Stop it.
Daniel (or whatever your real name is), you have been misinformed.
PFA is a think tank with:
(1) 50+ public policy professionals: http://www.pf-armenia.org/members
(2) an Executive Board: http://www.pf-armenia.org/executive-board, and
(3) an Academic Board: http://www.pf-armenia.org/academic-board.
What Raffi is doing is perfectly normal–it’s civil disobedience, and sometimes it’s necessary to turn authoritarian regimes into democracies. Even in established democracies, people sometimes resort to civil disobedience, which has helped make these countries what they are.
If Raffi is able not to lose the momentum, he can use the popular energy to paralize the Republic of Armenia internally, through a nationwide strike. Still peaceful, but powerful. It will force the authorities to resign. That is precisely how Armenians did the 1988 revolution. There were the same kinds of apologists (notably Catholicos Vazgen I’s televised speech) “warning” not to go against the Communist authorities in Armenia, or else we would “lose” Armenia altogether. Good thing the people didn’t listen to them. Without paralyzing the republic in 1988, we would not have the glorious revolution of 1988, and there would be no NKR.
Joghovurt! in Europe ir’s rumored that Raffi Hovanisian a scientologist ! What to think about that ?
I think it is a lie.
The intelligent believe in facts, the ignorant believe in rumors fed to them by their enemies (in our case, Russia, or the Serzh regime itself). I would like to think we are intelligent people.
Vahagn, I wonder if the supporters of division of a nation and its people in the diaspora are really smart people!
I am far from believing that the unsubtantial regime of R. Hovanissian, if he had won the elections (which is part of his imagination now) would have been better than that currently in place. I think on the contrary, he would have headed straight into the wall and led the country into a total KO, which would have delighted our enemies.
We are not supporting division in Armenia. To the contrary, we want everyone to unite. Against Serzh and around Raffi (and the democratic movement). It’s not our fault that Serzh is not joining our side.
As far as I remember, a large majority voted for Serzh Sarkissian, in other terms what you are saying is contrary to what you are thinking.
‘Division’ is the final result of the sum of your so-called [self-persuasive imaginary] unification processes.
I can appreciate the political fervor created by an opposition. It is healthy for Armenia to challenge the status quo and to pursue improvements in the political and economic process. Change is needed. Most will agree. The disagreements, as always , are over the methods , the time frame and who is the beneficiary of change.
There is no question there is discontent in Armenia, but the opposition is splintered and therefore minimalized . Raffi and his party benefited from this problem by garnering all of the protest and anti- establishment vote. But what happens when the ANC, PAP and ARF decide to enter the game again. Will they truly unify? Will they rally behind his candidacy? Probably not. Then where is the opposition? Is the goal to bring change or to being change with their party leading?
Public opposition movements are designed to change public opinion and force established political forces to compromise… Some of this can be orchestrated, Some is unpredictable. Armenia needs change without instability. That speaks volumes to the type of change and pace. If the public opposition is disappointed with the outcome of their investment, it could have very negative consequences.
My question is what is the end of the opposition process?We are experiencing the means. What will happen by April 9 as Raffi has stated and what if Sargsyan calls his bluff and does nothing? How will the thousands of sincere citizens react?
Will the two ladles cut a deal ? It seems to be the most practical solution that could bring ” change without instability”. I pray that our leaders understand the boundaries.
I sympathise with Raffi, but I don’t approve his last move. Though, I think he has already made an impact in the way of thinking of many citizens and Diaspora Armenians as well. The ramifications of this impact are sure to be felt in the Armenian politics for sometime to come. But I find his last move to go on hunger strike is a waste of energy and a hard won de facto victory. He should direct his attention and efforts instead to forging an alliance with other opposition forces, who are somewhat in disarray. He enjoys now a good measure of public support as well as support by other opposition forces and is strong enough to do that. It’s a pity that he is ruining his chances. Maybe it’s high time other oposition leaders and their parties too woke up and advised him or brought pressure on him to change course. After all, this is not only Raffi’s struggle. By their inaction they are spoiling also their chances to be of any relevance in the politics of Armenia.
Gaytzag; you are right – we must not forget that over a million people have already left Armenia. Those million voted with their feet. These votes should be included in the final tally.
Perouz!!!!
How right you are.Those million Armenian citizens living overseas…..
If you asked the majority of them would vote C H A N G E not present rule!!!
thence their votes-like you write with feet, should also be taken into account!!!!!!!!!
But do please consider that I am advocating for a step by step change—-
We saw WHAT overnight change from Communist despotic rule to Wild free market economy did to our beloved Homeland…
I have ¨´suggested¨ the mild Scanmdinavian model for Armenia.
Though some may think the cradle of civilization is Southern Europe(read the rule come down from old Greek Law, pasing through old English near 3 century old Parliamentary one to the French and American revolution Laws…..
I still prefer the Scaninavian ,model, srpot of Democratic Socialism….which unfortuantley our OWN TASHNAGS the ARF, has studied carefully.
I ¨´suggested a MILD CHANGE WITHIN THIS otherwise prestigious political party to undergo following:-
Rename it as Armenian Evolutionary(s) Federation, quite using the Red flag(the Tricolour that THEY ADHERED TO(bRAVO) IS ENMOUGH FOR THEM AND thus accept other small middle size political parties within their Evolutionar(IES) renovated rejuvdnitated Tashnagtsyun!!!
Send some emissaries to Couple of those countreis like Finland too, in order to bring hom their methods of taxing HJIGH TO THOSE WHO MAKE BIG MONEY WHEETHER FACTORIES OWNED BY THE Oligarks or non so , say at least 60/70% onm larger amounts , less on the middle type plants and businesses, etc.,e tc., and FREE MEDICAL HEALTH FOR ALL. SCHOOLING LIKE IN SWEDEN.
A younman I met on Airline heading to Yerevan told me he studies in Sweden for Free, gets 600 euros per month for his expenses from their Gov.t and pays 2 or 2 euros for subsidized lunch at Campus and when he completes his education at >University, must STAY 3 YEARS AND WORK FREE FOR GOVT., excepty above liek subsidies…after thast he can do as he pleases!!!
There are so many things that our Gov.t kimn armenia can LERN FROM FINLAND SWEDEN AND SWITZERLAND….
Sadly they only MAKE A BEE LINE FOR GLENDALE and there they think they are in rural or middle America, have very little knowledge what transpires , e.g. in Miin. or Idaho etc., or NY or Boston…Glendale for them is USA….
Please , ask the ARF to consider my suggestioins.As to
Raffi Hovhannisian´s Gandhi – esque(2nd time over9 move-decision…it is certaily his right to choose what he wishes….let us hope he does not harm his health to begin with, then alsohope very much that this move WILL MOVE THE CONSCIONS OF THOSE WHO THINK OTHERWISE!!!
I also wish to make a suggestion to Raffi to start naming a few of his choice and the people´s as well as politicla parties to set FWD their rep.s for his(Raffi´s) future Gvot. , such as Hirikian, Hrant Bagratian, the 3 last ARF Ministres that resigned when protocols issue popped up,namely Lokian ,Vardanyan and Vahan Hovaseian, one or two from Ramgarvar party and one or two from the Hunchagians and also I have suggested thatunñlike other parliament Congresses to inmclude one ea from oiur Spiritual establish,menmts the apostolic, Catholic and protestant, soas THOSE WHO ARE NON PARTISAN AND RATHER CHURCH MOTIVATED WILL ALSO BE REPRESENTED WITHIN OUR FUTURE APRLIAMENMT.FOR OUR PEOPLE ARE VERY CHRISTIAN AND BELIEVERS…AND THEIR VOICES MAY AND CAN COUNT.Especially we ahve amogns t our new clergy(the youn whether in _RA and/ or oversea very educated such….
Thanks for reading me
I am sorry, Gaytzag, what is wrong with Glendale? It’s the only place on earth where we Armenians have our own democracy. And we have turned it into a vibrant prosperous Armenian city at the foothill of mountains, just as Armenians like it.
The statement above , ” will the two ladies cut a deal” should read, ” will the two
LEADERS cut a deal” . My apologies.
The end of the popular opposition should obviously be democracy, which requires systematic change in the government. Ideally, the result of the movement would be a new constitution. The opposition leaders need to realize that the current constitution, which has picked-and-chosen the worst aspects of various constitutions worldwide, is designed to perpetuate the authoritarian regime (lack of judicial independence, five-year period between elections, regional governors chosen by Yerevan etc.). They either need to force the authorities to change the constitution, or force the authorities out so the opposition, after taking power, will forge a new constitution, hopefully modeled after a successful, established system (to me the right choice would be the U.S. one). That’s one clear plan that the opposition can afford to have.
PLease excuse my many typographical errors and or word erros above.Wrote very fast,in my above post.
Quite should read Quit, e.g. parliament badly spelt etc., Please delve into the meaning therein contained.Thank you.
Errata!!
Near forgot to rectify word ¨Rejuvenated¨ Tashnagtsutyun
Vahagn, I wonder if the supporters of division of a nation and its people in the diaspora are really smart people!
I am far from believing that the unsubtantial regime of R. Hovanissian, if he had won the elections (which is part of his imagination now) would have been better than that currently in place. I think on the contrary, he would have headed straight into the wall and I led the country in total KO, which would have delighted our enemies.
My opinion is that RH’s fasting is a pure vicious and shameful emotional blackmail.
I doubt that his name will go down in history, alongside those of famous personalities who practiced hunger strike.
Raffi needs to get over himself. This kind of arrogance and self-centeredness is very unbecoming. Yes, he’s a smart guy, but not that special. Someone should ask who is behind him, pushing him to do this? He is not acting alone. It would have been a refreshing change to see an Armenian election go unchallenged by the losers, but alas, that opportunity has been wasted.
I don’t understand Raffi’s decision to go on a Hunger Strike at this time, but I do wish him well. I hope it brings about some unforseen positive changes for Armenians. I also hope that my fellow Armenians posting here will be less attacking of him personally. We can question his actions and still be civil.
{“I don’t understand Raffi’s decision…”}
Boyajian:
if you watch the pictures of Hovannisian’s public appearances post-election, you can see crowds dwindling rapidly as time went by.
In one of the recent meetings he asked those present whether he should take the matter to Constitutional Court: even his followers voted “No”.
Yet he went ahead with it anyway. My sense is that even his followers can now see the writing on the wall.
(http://news.am/eng/news/142472.html)
My guess is that RH saw his appeal and popularity fading fast, and impulsively decided to take this drastic step to remain in the center of attention. Even during his hunger strike, you can see his followers have already moved on: in all the photos, I observe no more than about 10, maybe max 20 people standing around in support. You can see other people just walk by.
Sad end to a promising start.
Regarding name calling: I agree, but you need to give the same admonition to those who name-call President Sargsyan.
Read some of the names people in Hovannisian’s camp call the President on these pages.
And Mr. Hovannisian has publicly and regularly disrespected and continues disrespecting President Sargsyan , even though the Pres has been uniformly civil towards him. So what goes around comes around.
Dear David Boyadjian, I don’t think anyone writing here knows Raffi personally. But we can all see his actions. He is not a real patriot. A patriot will look after the country and its strength in the world first. All his actions so far have done nothing but weaken the Armenian government’s position in the world. Is that patriotic? If he comes to power in five years he will get the results of his actions today, which is an internationally weak state. It is sickening to see all this self serving actions from our so called leaders. Armenia is a small country with a small population it is much easier to weaken it than a larger country. Raffi should demonstrate that he is a leader. He has not done this yet. If he was a good leader, he would have congratulated Serge and mover forward and gained everyone’s respect. He could demonstrate his leadership by working for Armenia. Being born in the US does not make him special. All Armenians are special. He should demonstrate his leadership. Instead he is telling the world Serge’s government is illegitimate. How would that serve the country? We all know that Serge will be there for the next five years. How is Raffi strengthening Armenia? How is he influencing the government’s policies? What exactly is his platform? Did he negotiate with Serge to include some of his principals in the new government? Was there an announcement, following his meeting with Serge, indicating this? This is what a real leader should do. All we hear about is Poor Raffi is on hunger strike and withering away. All of us in the US know that getting thin is a major objective and always a New Year resolution! Using it for political gain takes the cake!!
Frederick Fuller, I am not David Boyajian.
Also you make some very good points regarding alternate ways that Raffi could serve his nation at this point in history when he finds himself with real potential to influence policy.
Do you really believe that Raffi is doing all this in service of his ego or waistline or because he sincerely, even if misguidedly, believes that it will help his challenge to Serzh Sarkissian?
Boyajian, My apologies for the mistaken identity.
Very correct Boyajian.
Some are really histerical about Raffi’s person.
Mr Hovanissian is demonstrating an irresponsible behavior.
I don’t think Boyadjian, Arshak and others who argue here from a similar position underestimate RH’s achievement which, of course, would not have been possible without the energetic participation of his young and talented staff in his Heritage Party and his Centre for Strategic Research – Gaydzak and others – the email shots of which I have been receiving for at least 6 years.
However I still say RH should build on these rather than throw them away.
This means instead of throwing tantrums – which is infantile – he must act like a statesman and a leader, which is much more difficult; it requires nerves of steel and patient ‘diplomacy’ rather than erratic and trigger happy – “over my dead body” – ‘policy’ on the hoof!
How could “over my dead body” help anything? It is more like a ridiculous childish tantrum, than a well thought out programme of action to successfully challenge the well-entrenched and organised oligarchic system. In fact it is precisely the underestimation of this well-entrenched and organised adversary in control of the system (the oligarchs/RPA, etc.) and its ability, by hook or crook, to organise electoral victory for themselves (rather like the rich everywhere, the Republicans in the US and the Tories in the YUK, etc. – MONEY DOES TALK!) which is the problem and that leads to such frustrated behaviour and infantile tantrum which ultimately will harm and hurt the people.
What RH is doing is imitation politics and that is a real pity. He must show some grace and statesmanship and real leadership. He must build on the magnificent successes of the past few weeks for bigger and bigger victories in regional, village, and city and at the national level and force the oligarchic adversary to retreat everywhere. That might not be very exciting and require a great deal of organisation and effort but it will produce real, tangible and positive results for the people and the future of our country.
Agree with Avery and Boyadjian.
One or two last words: Basically RH and his young and inexperienced team have given the adversary (call it what you like – RPA, SS, oligarchs, etc.) in charge of the system and governemnt authority A BLOODY NOSE which is still a great victory considering the apathy and disillusionment that dominated the people’s camp only a few weeks ago.
RH must accept the results gracefully and start building on this victory to organise and mobilise to give hope to the people. Instead he is resorting to empty rhetoric and bullying which is only undermining his credibility.Stop the tantrums and start building and mobilising for victories at every level. You are not there yet.
“What RH is doing is imitation politics and that is a real pity.”
Absolutely right.
“RH must accept the results gracefully.”
I am afraid that is stronger than him, he is just incapable to do it.
And between us it’s a bit late to get out “graciously” of this mess !
“Stop the tantrums”
This is obviously his authentic character, difficult to be otherwise, he’s a false calm and this is obvious when he plays trying to hide his nervousness. Not a favorable point for someone who has such ambitions in politics.
“start building and mobilising for victories at every level. You are not there yet.”
Too late. He’s already out of the game, and his place into oblivion.
Dear Raffi Hovanissian, you are already on the last page of the book, you can now close it and store it…and make a wish.
Raffi is shooting himself in the foot big time. Considering how slim the pickings are Serge might be the best person out there. Considering the cronyism of the country this is not saying much!
I think Serge Sarkissian Should resigne as a model of integrity so that when the time comes for our next door’s dictator aliyev’s re-election on October 15 this year, our country won’t be seating in a GLASS HOUSE to throw stone at our neighbour.
(1) the issue is not who RH is and can do. The issue is in the principle of rule of law and fair and free election. If any of you think the Feb 18 elections were free and fair, or even close to it, I am sorry for you.
(2) What RH can and cannot do is neither your nor my business to judge. The people of Armenia currently residing in Republic of Armenia are to judge. This especially true since none of us have see him lead the nation.
(3) I do not give a damn to the international community and their opinion. The opinion and voice of the citizens of Armenia residing in Armenia is the only one that matters for me.
Note: I am not going to engage in senseless conversation.
Perfectly said, Vahe. Agree on all points. And you don’t need to engage in senseless conversation.
Hooray ! Here are the words of anti-wisdom of a dictator who preaches a false & predefined and limited democracy and where his word is a non-protestable command.
Totally absurd Vahe.
to Vahagn
Why do you twist thigns around.
There is noting wrong with Glendale ….been there several times over….no need to describe its advatages…… landscape etc.,
What I tried to convey was that for some(newcomers) or those who come stay for a while and leave, Glendale ,CA is representative of the whole USA and all that it involves,whether demographically, economically and/or politically.
I wish the best for our compatriots who reside there and their vibrant march ahead. I take it you are now satisfied with aforementioned description.
But if you wish to learn more , there are many other aspects to USA, beginning its capital ,Washington D.C. the lobbying that goes on there , the legislators etc., which is what makes it different from Glendale …etc., etc., etc.,
Sadly we do not muster clout in D.C. enough ,such as other ethnic groups.In our case best would be to compare us with the Greek or Jewish experiences shall we say. Ours has been (unfortunately fragmented) very very Armenian( a style by itself) viz. the fight over the Fantastic Bldg. purchased by Cafesjian,Hovanian and an armenian lady…the first one investing 11 million the second 1.5 million and the lady some 4 million and now a legal fight between the first two as to its DIRECTORSHIP!!!
Even a teen ager who has completed some high school study would explain the person who invests more has more say…but in ARMENIANDOM!!1 not (my advocated armenity) it is the other way around.The fighjt goes on—and the pueblo the people the armenian people LOOSES THE CHANCE OF HAVING THAT PRESTIGIOUS BLDG NEXT TO CAPITOL as its MUSEUM ,housing also, as the Genocide memorial Bldg. etc.,
So let´s talk turkey, shall we ….
Ok, but how is Glendale different from the rest of the USA? Other than demographically. And what is wrong with the USA that Armenians need to know? Isn’t it the case that it is the only true country in the world, and all other countries merely pretend to be countries?
I give in a bit now and tend to agree with Bagratuni that RH -especially lately-is acting rather like Bagratuni describes,outside of his previous beginning stage of the elections…
he should conduct a more serene and tactful process.Somewhere I read -if not here- on Panmarmenian.net that he is planning other stratagems.Hopefully he also does consult with other politicians that might give him a hand.
I ,persoanlly also expected that his father Prof. Richard G.Hovhanissian would also sort of encourage him if not outright support him in the elections but now.
However, it behooves also to the other traditionmal political parties (only one left, namely the ARF.( as the Ramgavaragans and the Hunchags have joine forces w/serge Sargsyan,plus the other non poliotical armenian establishments.
RH is in a rather tough spot now.If no other than ARF and PAP are there, and these seem to be reluctant to give hima hand ,indeed for their own reasons,their objectives. Alone latter two also cannot paint(pinatar, from spanish) nada!!!
Time will tell that this chance for a Real change will take shape or go back to a regime that has shown its unability to curb at the very least the immigration.let alone small BUT IMPORTANT ISSUES as garbage collecting of the capital city of Armenia,Yerevaqn!!!!
in light of so much foreign aid and Loans, a hundred modern automated garbage trucks, plus the 1000 or so Large squarish Bins would do the job.
And this is one small example of such failed projects.
Hoping the best for Armenia and one more thing.
pres.Serge Sargsayn goes and confers with foreign dignitaries ,I trust some of latter do really intend to help RA in aspects that are important for Armenia. Comes to mind RE STARTING THE ABANDONED MANY MANY ex soviet plants,creating jobs for tens of thousands….
These are issues that need redress and fast.Not forgetting have the 60 and over Armenian embassies and consulates produce some beneficial deeds,such as begin to counteract to axeri attempts to preempt our Quest for recogn ition of the armenian Genocide onm the threshold of its 100th Anniversary.Anyhow, it must be on their minds too.I refer to those who are at the helm of our tiny republic(s)…
Hama Haigagani SIRO
With all due respect, Raffi has not won elections. His claim that he garnered 80% of votes cannot be supported even by PFA puppets who advanced a flawed mathematical model to prove there was mass scale fraud. If one were to follow that model elections in MA and Ohio were falsified by Obama. His legal team at the Constitutional Court has demonstrated sheer incompetence. Out of 107 violations registered on Raffi’s website 60 are anonymous. His own members of TECs put signatures on vote-count protocols. His team now claims that they were all bribed and\or intimidated. That, however, did not apparently work in a significant number of precincts where he indeed won – no one interfered, no one obstructed. If bribed and intimidated Raffi’s team violtated laws what should be expected from them in government? Finally, his recent Gandhi mimicking to stage destabilization is out of the Armenian cultural context. Gandhi was not engaging in public hunger strikes nor is that behavior acceptable from Christian perspective. Blackmailing with a suicide is both childish and unChristian. Raffi could have done a service to Armenia by steadfastly developing a strong unified and well organized opposition party instead of this messiah stunt. Chance that he still will be able to do that are getting slimmer with every day. The upcoming mayoral elections in Yerevan will leave him and his party with the same under 10% rating. Moreover, it is this kind of behavior that cannot reach its goals has a demoralizing effect after the dust settles. The Armenian nation does not need the disunity and discord that is advanced by various politicos and PFAs.
To Vahagn,
The lobbying that is unique to D.C. and other important cities such as NY.
Our own small lobby in D.c. the Tashnags and the Armenian Assembly are doing their very best,but so far rather small basis.Just yesterday they showed some little sign that ARtsakh (nagornyi karabagh) is there…at the 25th An niversay of latter´s Independence.Gpood sign ,this tyupe pon a a mmuch STRONGER SCALE ought to be carried out in L.A. NY and important cities as of NOWNo need to wait April 24 as it has been the custom…
From now every day is our BAHANJADIRUTYUN /Demanding JUSTICE.
For the whole world owes Armenians that…
While you are debating Raffi’s personality, we are trying to change our country into a better place. If you at all care about Armenia, leave your warmed up sits wherever they might be, Los, Beirut or Antarctica, and come help us with the change. Otherwise, shut the hell up. Nobody has a say in it, except people who live in Armenia and struggle everyday with the evils like those who run us into the ground for past 20 years. I will take my chances with Raffi, I and hundreds of thousands of my people who will not give up on their right to live in a free country.
Ruben, people who feel like you are our hope for saving Armenia. It’s great to see that people in Armenia know what needs to be done. Keep it up, and you guys have our full support.
Dear Ruben Malayan,
I sympathize with you and uphold your very compatriotic stance w/rgd to asking Diasporans to unite with those on the scene in RA.
This indeed gives me or others likee me and you to ASK,why???
Why on earth,at the very least ONE political party , such as ARF.does not join him.Raffi alone cannot perform miracles,as, like someone,above,has mentioned even the OSCE report on rigging having been excercized is not considered by the Constitutional court(probably on another thread here)…
Then dear RUBEN, best VENUE(THIS TO VAHAGN AS WELL)is where you do it and also L.A. and Paris(two main arteries of the Armenian DIASPORA!!!
Exactly where the infamous protocols were REJECTED!!!!!
Addendum,
My above post also answers ARTHUR´s.
Last part of his post that is…
That Raffi hsould ahve developed a ¨unified:::: party, or to that effect.
Dear arthur are you not aware that like I wrote here on another thread.last weel..ARF through its important bureau chief Mr. Rustamian did ONCE only once show up alongside RAffi and it was expected by thus doing at the very least his party would join forces with Raffi´s Heritage????
There has be no resonance since then…..what happened??
changed opinion? if so then Raffi ought to resort to a steady , calmer way of resistance.If not by hunger strike…then(let others guess how)
But one thing is certain, it is not only the RA present Governemnt( i hate to call that Ishkhanutyun-which measn country of princes…….or is it???
is being well supported8like in the casde of the protocols remember. Javier Solan8rep. EU), Miss Clinton (USA) and Lavrov (RF) period…
not much can be done.Armenia has then become a sattelite state of the aforementioned….sadly…
First of all, I am not discussing Raffi’s personality. It could be an interesting exercise in psychological profiling of a leader. I am discussing a very simple point – to manage change of that scale he has neither a team nor a strategy. Secondly, you need to listen more carefully to your leader and tone it down, sonny. Remember, “barevolution” is about love, tolerance and peace, not animosity and hostilty that you are spewing here. Thirdly, last I checked Raffi’s statements, he defines the nation very differntly from you and very close to how I understand it. Fourth, I am a citizen of Armenia and it is none of your business where I am writing from now. Fifth, we don’t know how many people are standing by Raffi. Judging by the last rally – several thousand. I agree many more want to see change, may be even millions. The difference is in how and at what price. In March 2008 there were thousands of fake revolutionaries like yourself. The price we paid was Armenian blood spilled by Armenians and slower change than it could have been.
Looks like I am being addressed to.If so, please note I am not a Revolutionary far from it I’d dub myself as an Evolutionary*if that would be necessary really to describe my stance.i have been an activist from long ago beginning France and ending in that country.Ours was not a politicla aprty but a very HARD try to group togehter all Armenian factions there and that at a time that can best be described as tumultuous ,rather stormy viz the 1970′ 1980’s,when armenian were very much polarized.
I don’t believe your above description of RAffi is conclusive at all!!!!
he neither tried to DISTURB PEACE,nor stirr up political unrest.Never in his speaches he passed the margin!!!
if the man has not been able to have others extend a hand to him,it’s not his \fault.
As rgds your sentence above *if referring to me, that, and I quote”animosity and hostility that your are spewing here…””I think you err tremendously,again if addressing to me.you have to take back what you wrote.I a,m a man of peace.BUT A PATRIOT INDEED, THAT I AM and no newcomer who knows so little about the intricacies of politics can come up and try to stick such phrases to me!!!
Finally Raffi is not what you imagine he is and does not lack teams*of his own, not from political parties.Latter,as i have explained above each has gone its own way..UNFORTUNATELY …no cooperation is on the scene,alas!!!
in which case you are the one who is trying to unnerve people like me in which you will not succeed. Also no one -not me -anyhow asked where you ARE WRITING FROM .I would not care a bit to know.To surmise THE HOMELAND IS OF ALL ARMENIANS ,NO HAS MONOPOLY ON OUR FATHERLAND.IT BELONGS TO ALL ARMENIANS!!! every one of us!!!!
Gaydzag, my previous comment was not addressed to you. This one is. It is a leader’s responsibilty to negotiate deals with others. When he goes to negotiate and comes with three “no-s” to a very poor alternative to the deal of over his dead body, it means that he lacks the skill. Raffi is not a politician, he is a charismatic leade. As a politician, he has been sloppy. I will leave you with one question to reflect. Where is Mr. Kokobelyan (assuming you know who the man is) who was included in the Heritage list for the last parliamentary elections and got a seat for nothing but the promise to support the party financially? As to your understanding of the Armenian nation, I am in an agreement with you and Raffi. I simply did not see a strong enough rebuttal to David from IMF on his venomous statement about “Robik and Serzhik” being not from Armenia. They both are. Those who are calling on to continue the “fight to the end” well aware that in the end of that end is blood do not belong to Armenia.
Arthur,
I am not from those hard headed Armenians(even at my very advanced age,for so are our people,unfotunately…) I agree w/the fct that the phrase ¨over my dead body¨´has no place in diplomacy..alas,Raffi did not from the beginning( I wrote him at his email address)to not go it alone, get a few to go together…he did not heed my suggestion(s) not even replied to a few of my such..
Kokobelyan sounds familiar and I believe what you write (we are here not to lie to ea other).As to comments by David,I recall that bit…ugly indeed to write that!!
from IMF do you mean he is from the Int´l Monetary Fund? or else what do these IMF stand for..
Indeed no Armenian in his right mind wishes bloodshed.I have posted on another thread here in reply to Avery w/rgd to …please go check there.
I am of the opinion that raffi did prepare well before opting for the position of pres. he did not have enough force.Not even from his family….and friends,which surprises me very much.His Father could have done a bit …..
Addendum,
I am the very Mezhdunarodnaya(int´l type so to say,I know some russian)Now then…..¨¨OVER MY DEAD BODY¨IS A PHRASE¨ is to convey negativeness (US style) which indeed Raffi having been born here and studied here not just schooling but every day contacts with pals etc., (Uracrel) in Armenian now, means has incorporated that into his psyche…and,,,,,,when agitated with what went pon in his quest for presidency,everyday visits to Avana and Regions etc., when lost….the elections(my viewpoint is also not only rigged but like someone here before wrote…NOT TAKING INTO ACCOUNT THJE VOTES OF THSOE THAT LEFT THE HOMELAND FOR BREAD….THOSE > the easy type to arouse his her anger,,,,LOOSES.END OF MY LITTLE SERMON.Please excuse me for this.